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…we take someone’s question or their certain situation in business, a struggle, an obstacle that they’re facing and we try to help them here on the podcast. That’s what I want to do again here today and I’m really excited to have a good friend of mine come back on again.
His name is Chris Schieffer, you guys probably have heard me talk about him quite a bit. Him and I are good friends but we also share a lot of similar ideas as far as this business goes and e-commerce and all of that good stuff, so really, really excited if you couldn’t tell, that you’re here, I think this is going to be valuable for you. Now just to let you guys know we do have show notes and we have full transcripts now to these episodes. If you want to download the complete transcripts or go to the show notes and get all of that good stuff, head over to theamazingseller.com/197, that’s episode 197, so again, that’s theamazingseller.com/197.
You’ll get all the show notes and you'll also get all of the transcripts whether you want to read them there or therefore download them, they are there for you any links we discussed will be there as well. Alright so I’m going to stop talking now. We’re going to go ahead and get into this hot seat. Chris and I had a great, great conversation here and just to let you guys know, we’re kind of in training here because as at the time that this is being aired, actually it’s not in training because we're actually going to be doing it. This is going to air on May 2nd I believe and we’ll be doing a live event with real hot seats live in person on May 1st.
I guess we’re training now because we’re not doing it but we’re going to be doing it so if that makes sense. We are getting warmed up for the big day which is May 1st but you're listening to this probably on May 2. Anyway you're going to learn something from listening to this I'm sure and I'm really excited to share it with you, so here is the hot seat session I did with Chris Schafer.
[00:02:14] SV: Well hey Chris, what is going on my brother, how are you doing man?
[00:02:19] CS: Doing good man, sitting here starting my morning off right with a little conversation with Scotty V, doing a hot seat, looking forward to it man.
[00:02:27] SV: Yeah this is fun and actually it's kind of crazy because we are going to be doing this live and depending on when people are listening to this, we’re getting close to where we're going to be doing this for 10 people, actually hot seat sessions that is, and there’s going to be another 20 people attending sitting in on this and also hopefully adding some of their bits and pieces of experience but yeah I'm really, really excited about this live event. The TAS Breakthrough Live that is and so this is again is like our warm-up, getting our I guess our game on right?
[00:03:02] CS: Our training montage if you will.
[00:03:04] SV: Exactly, now you and I have done a few of these already and I have to say the response has been really, really good. People are really enjoying them, I think people like real life examples and also having us kind of brainstorm back and forth as if we were helping him one on one. This one here was from one of our students actually in the private label classroom. He actually reached out to us and he had some questions and he already had a product launch before he joined the class okay and what he said here and again I'm not go through the whole story and all that stuff but I just want to kind of get right to it.
The one thing that he said here, he didn’t record a voicemail for us but he did give us his issue and his struggles, kind of like what he is battling with right now. One of the big things is that he's launched a product, it was doing okay and then he just started losing sales and now what he wants to know is, how do I re-launch that product, is there a way to re-launch a product to get it going again, is it worth it or should I just abandon that product altogether and start from scratch? That was kind of like his questions. The other thing that he wanted, was us to take a look at the product, the listing and maybe even just the market, give our opinions and maybe pull it up in Jungle Scout, see what the numbers look like. That’s what I want to do here for Daniel. Chris are you ready to dive in here? I know that you've kind of taken a look at some of his stuff that he’s already put out there, some of the numbers and stuff but are you ready to dig in here?
[00:04:40] CS: Yeah, let’s just jump right in.
[00:04:41] SV: All right, cool, so first off, let’s just go into the numbers okay, as they are right now like pulling up his main keyword and it was very obvious right away his main keyword, which perfectly done, as far as in his title and all that stuff. Knowing what the main keyword is we pulled it up in Jungle Scout and let me go ahead pull it up now so we can both look at that together once again.
First glance Chris, looking at the Jungle Scout numbers and again we can't show you guys these numbers but we’re going to walk you through them because it’s audio obviously but Chris looking at the numbers in Jungle Scout, pulling them up today, what’s your thoughts?
[00:05:19] CS: There's a couple of things, the first thing that jumps out is that average sales number, right. The volume in the market looks really, really good until you start to dig into it a little bit further and you realize that a lot of those products are actually different styles of the same product. Some of which seem to have a higher perceived value to begin with, does that make sense?
[00:05:39] SV: Yeah, it totally does.
[00:05:42] CS: The next thing that I'm seeing here is that the price points are a little all over the place, you know that the top two listings number one and number two, $27.99, 57 bucks, that looks really good. The guy that's selling $27, $28 is doing almost 4000 sales a month. That looks awesome until you realize that it’s a different style from what a lot of the other people that are selling in this market have.
[00:06:06] SV: Let's just talk about that real quick though because when people, when they look at the first page and then they’re looking whether looking in Jungle Scout or not, when looking at the first page, you don't see unless you hover over the product to see exactly what the product is, and I think it's really important to understand that when you're looking at a product, you want to be comparing apples to apples. You don't want to say, “Oh the numbers look great and there's a $27.99 price point,” but the one that you're going to be really selling is really more like this one that might be $17.97.
Just want people to be in a really clear on that. When you are looking at the stuff, you might look at the top 16 results but there might only be four or five of those products that are what you're going to be selling, they’re similar. Does that make sense Chris?
[00:06:46] CS: Yeah, a lot of times Scott what you and I say is, “Well if it serves the same function you probably want to count in those results,” right? In this case it is a very different style of product. There’s two different people who would buy that and this is one of those things where it's kind of like a gut, that’s my gut reaction is there's two different people who would buy this style. It’s not like a garlic press where one presses up and one presses down, it's a completely different style, it’s a different material. It would appeal to a different kind of person. One would appeal to more like a higher-end taste and the other one would appeal to someone who just needs the thing to get it done and the style that we have here that he that he has two different variations of, appeals more to the people who just want to get the thing and do what it’s designed to do.
That's kind of the gut feel when we look at this and again generally we say if it serves the same function, you're probably good to go but when you’re looking at the different materials on this and the different makeup, it does make a difference in this case and that's why it makes sense to at the very least hover over if not scroll through that first page of results and just see what the differences are in the products.
[00:08:05] SV: Yeah and I want to go now to okay so like if we’ve done that like we've figured out that maybe one is plastic and one is stainless steel, let’s just say that. Well, in this case let's say that the first three results because that’s what I'm looking at or actually the first two results are that let's say that they’re plastic and the next one is made of the better material in a sense but yet the plastic one’s selling better but there's other components that which we can't describe but just to get a little bit of a visual.
If we moved to position number three, it is basically the same product, right? It's the same product so now let's look at that. We're number three they’re ranked number three for this keyword okay and they're selling for $17.97, their sales rank in home and kitchen is 3,519 and the estimated monthly sales is 998. That’s about $17,934, they have 246 reviews and a four and a half star rating and it’s fulfilled by Amazon. Okay. Now that all sounds great on the surface but the other thing that you want to look at there is okay was that 998 part of a promotion that they ran, that's when we would do, like that back searching we would want to look in Camel Camel Camel or in Keepa, I believe it’s Keepa right, isn’t that what it's called now? Yeah Keepa and that’s built into Jungle Scout now.
If I’m looking at that, it looks like this data is being pulled in since January 16th so that could be a fresh listing. I would then want to go into Camel Camel Camel and then see if that product was selling longer than January 16th because I think that Camel Camel Camel definitely has a little bit longer history out there. Besides that I would look at that and I go, “Okay, that's cool, 1,000 they are selling a month technically at 246 if all the numbers check out.” Let's move on to position number four, that is very similar to the first and second, so it doesn't compare to the one that I'm selling.
Move to position five, it’s the exact product that we’re selling okay, so now we look at that one that was $25.99, same category and they are selling 403 per month technically and 476 reviews. Now if I click on the rank on that inside of Jungle Scout I can see it’s back in January 16th. So Chris, do you see that? I'm also noticing that I think people just while doing this live here, on Keepa.com I'm noticing that, and I've noticed this myself before we even did this today Chris, is that a lot of their date is only going back to like January of this year, so I'm just wondering if that something has to be updated or if you go over to Camel Camel Camel you'll get a different result which maybe we should do that just to verify that.
[00:10:42] CS: Well, I took a look at listing number three and it's been selling since June of last year.
[00:10:47] SV: Okay so that's huge. That is huge, so I don’t know if I'd necessarily even look at that. I mean it's a quick good glance to see inside of Jungle Scout but then I would probably hop out and go over to Camel Camel Camel. So if that's the case though with number three so that we can say okay this is a pretty seasonal listing right? That 998 is probably accurate, it's probably close to being accurate 246 reviews not too many but let's now look at his listing. He's got 76 reviews okay 76-ish, something like that, but here's the strange thing… Chris now when we talk quickly about what we noticed from the two different listings that he sent over to us to look at? Why don’t you talk about that?
[00:11:26] CS: There’s two things that immediately stuck out and he sent us both listings that he wanted us to look at which appeared to both be his products. The first thing that I noticed is one, it's two different colors of the same product and we don't have them set up as a variation listing. Now as I have heard Scott and I talk about parent-child listings, variation listings in the past, my general rule of thumb is there's never a reason not to set it up that way. You can and I understand why you may want to take up two spots in the search results, does that make sense?
[00:12:05] SV: Yeah. I lost you Chris, you back?
[00:12:10] CS: Yeah, it said Scott Voelker went off-line.
[00:12:16] SV: I’m here. We are back, all right Chris. What are you saying now? You were saying it was about two listings, we were talking about variations, kind of dig back into that.
[00:12:24] CS: Yeah. If you if you heard Scott and I talk about variation listings in the past, my stance on this is there's not really ever a reason not to set it up as a parent-child listing. I understand why some people may not do that because they’re trying to take up two spots on the search results page but in my experience, unless you're going to actively promote those and do a lot of extra work to try to get that second spot, it’s not really worth it because you can drive all of that traffic to one listing, let the person pick the one that they want to buy and you actually see a higher conversion rate.
The other thing is, you get to combine those reviews right? It looks like one of these has like 76 and one of these only has 3. Maybe the one with three is actually a more popular color if you combine that with one at 76, you now up to 79 reviews, yes that difference of three doesn’t make a big difference for the first color but for the second color, it can make a huge difference, right?
That may actually end up being the one that sells more and he’s actually got that one priced higher which to me means either he thinks he’s going to sell more or it cost more. Either way you want to justify that with a higher number of reviews, does that make sense?
[00:13:35] SV: Yeah, it does and let's talk about it really quickly, we won’t go off of that too much but as far as his numbers like right now we looked at his numbers pulling up in Jungle Scout and what did we figure he’s selling per day approximately or per month?
[00:13:48] CS: Just under eight a day between the two listings.
[00:13:52] SV: Okay so about eight a day. Now we know that this is a pretty competitive space, from where he's in and the depth right now that the demand and the depth and all that will change because it could be I think a fourth-quarter product as well, but I think it could sell pretty well throughout the year. Again, we’re looking at his situation and kind of what he's up against.
We move down the list a little bit further and we can see there's other people again $19.99 with 860 reviews, selling 855 a month. We've got another one here that's different, then we go to position eight $13.91, 612 sales, 127 reviews, so clearly it looks like they're new and they're trying to get sales organically now, which they’ve gotten to page one, they are in a price target organic sales and their price to sell.
I’m not sure how they can make a lot of money at $13.91 for this particular product but like again, it might be a strategy that they're trying to do to gain position and it's worked whatever they've done because they’re page one. Again you're battling with people that are doing the same thing right now to try to get page one because clearly they only have 127 reviews and then if we go down a little bit further, we have someone in that ninth position, same idea $14.99, very similar product, 509 sales at 350 reviews. Again seems like probably doing a promotion of some kind and trying to gain it by pricing lower than anyone else, here’s kind of like the race to the bottom right?
This is what can happen. The next one position number 10 very similar product $23.99, they're selling 903 at 324 reviews. That’s kind of interesting, I'm not sure if they’re a bigger brand or not, I don't think they are but they're definitely selling more and they’re priced higher, so maybe people think that it's a better product right? Once you get on page one and you price it higher, that might work, something to test but you got to get to page one first, right? Then we can go to the next one, position 11, very similar product $24.99, selling 862 with only 75 reviews.
That to me is a standout, It's probably a brand-new product that's being promoted and again we can do some research going back to see how long they’ve been selling. If I go to Keepa right now, February 1st so yah, fairly new. Again I can just keep going down the list we go around at position number 13, same product $21.90, 564 sales, 586 reviews. 14 position is again a private-labeler, $14.99, 568 sales, 340 reviews. Let’s see, one more let's go to position 15 that's different, position 16 the same product $10.99, 573 sales at 137 reviews. With that all being said Chris what’s your thoughts on what we just went over?
[00:16:46] CS: Looking at this, there clearly is enough room in the market for people of all different price points. One of the initial things that you and I had kind of talked about was man a lot of these guys have a low price point but going through this, there are a couple who are selling stuff, it’s a very similar or the same product at a higher price point. The thing is, at this point he's not review competitive, right? He’s got 79 reviews, the guys who are selling at that higher price point have 300, 400, 500 reviews, that's kind of something that sticks out to me.
The other thing that I'm noticing as we're scrolling through this is he's not showing up for PPC, I don’t know if he is not running it or if his bids aren’t where they need to be or what's going on there. The two things that really stick out to me are it does look like there's a lot of depth in this market. It just kind of scrolling through here. Even when you discount that other quality, that other kind of product. I wouldn't necessarily cast this one aside but I would do probably a more constructive re-launch if that makes sense and maybe do another giveaway to try to get to 200 or 300 reviews and start aggressively running PPC, does that make sense?
[00:17:57] SV: Yeah it makes total sense and let's kind of talk about that a little bit because I want to give him some action steps as well and anyone else that’s listening that might be in a similar situation and actually something right now that I'm currently doing myself, which we talked about and it's kind of similar because I had a product that was not as competitive in the very beginning days. His sense become kind of the garlic press of my market and now because of that it's really hard to differentiate so I've created a variation off of that with the less of one item to hopefully get people in on price but then see the better value as they come in.
I think with what you're saying too is, if someone searching for a certain color and you have that variation underneath that one listing then that's going to help you because it's going to build out that particular listing as far as getting it more rooted. When you put all that energy into a listing, it's going to be easier to put all in the one versus to scatter out amongst two unless they need to be separated. In this case, we’re just talking like color, so in this case and again talking about action steps and what I'm even currently doing is, I would say to kind of come up with a launch plan and then go ahead and aggressively turn on Pay Per Click and really only target those handful of sales.
Right now, if you've been selling for a good amount of time, even three months, you’re going to have the data, right? Take the data from your Pay Per Click and then look at the ones that have converted, only the ones that have converted to sales, bring them out, pull them out of those campaigns, put them into one campaign and aggressively go after those keywords. Put them in a phrase, don't put them in an exact. I don't think I would do that know Chris made you have other thoughts on that, but I’d put them in a phrase at this point and then from there I would start aggressively sending traffic to those keywords because that’s going to help me rank. Especially for this main keyword. That's the one that you really want to again spend some money, you might break even, you might lose a little bit of money, but if we can get to page one then we know we’re going to be able to get the sales in the future.
Then from there as the reviews build, that’s why the promotion is really in place and the promotion is necessarily just to get page one, it's really to get the reviews, so when you get to page one you’re going to convert higher. Does that make sense Chris?
[00:20:21] CS: It does and something that I’m noticing, one of his products is on the second page for his main keyword. Granted he’s at the bottom of the second page right? But the thing that I noticed when I found this listing is that it really does stand out because everybody and he did something that we kind of glossed over, he did differentiate, even though it’s the same product that a lot of these other people are selling he did differentiate it from something that everyone else is doing. Everybody else just went with the stock manufacturer version. He did do some things to make it look at least a little bit higher-end and so if he can get onto that first page with that it's going to make a difference.
[00:21:01] SV: Then we should probably think about putting a lot of energy to push that to page one which would probably be Pay Per Click.
I would say the best way in and especially now we’re talking about you people saying that the Amazon’s cracking down on super URLs to get yourself up to page one, even if you don't do something like that which I think right now, it's a judgment call. If you want to do it fine, just be careful and there could be some consequences but the safe way of doing it is to run Pay Per Click because if you get sales through that keyword, through Pay Per Click, it's going to help you get on page one and once you do that promo that is going to help your overall BSR and then that will also trigger some things inside of the algorithm. What do you think Chris?
[00:21:47] CS: I think that’s spot on and I think what he needs to do is what you just kind of walked him through which is take a look at that search terms report, see it if you've been running PPC, if you haven't please, please, please, please turn on PPC.
[00:21:59] SV: Start that, start that.
[00:22:02] CS: Customer search terms report is one of the most powerful things you can have in terms of Amazon. They don't show us a lot of analytics, they don't show us what organic keywords are contributing sales to our listings but they do show us what paid terms drive traffic and drive sales. If we can look in that report and find out the exact words that people are using to drive traffic to our listings and to drive sales to our listings then we can use that maybe we go in and modify the title of the listing, maybe we go in and modify our keywords in the back end and that's another thing. If he set this up a couple months ago, he may not have had the expanded search terms section in the backend of his listing when he did that and I'm noticing a lot of sellers have still not taken advantage of that expanded keyword section. If you haven't taken advantage of that, fill that out completely.
[00:22:53] SV: Even if you don't think that you’re doing it perfectly, just fill it. Even if you-
[00:22:59] CS: Even if it’s filled with was and the, and some of those kind of things at this point,
[00:23:03] SV: Exactly.
[00:23:03] CS: Fill it out and then come back and go, “Okay, I have 100 characters worth of filler words, let's find 100 characters worth of other words that actually make more sense.”
[00:23:12] SV: Yeah and I mean a simple way, while we’re talking about that, a simple way to do that and it's something that I'm actually refining right now, is just do exactly what you would do if you’re going to run in all those keywords for your Pay Per Click campaign, do a merchant word search, do a Google planner search and use maybe their ASINs, do a keyword scrape inside of, what is it simple, keywordinspector.com, use that one, just use any different research tool you can just get variations of ideas off of your main keyword.
Then from there just drop them in there. I've talked to a few people Chris that have been saying that they have been seeing a difference when you have those keywords make sense rather than just dropping them in there randomly but my thing is, it can take hours if not days to really think about how to position them and structure them in such a way. I know you and I both said that we believe that Amazon will just pick the ones that make them make sense but someone that I recently talked to said he tested and he’s seen a difference especially in the first sentence of that or in the first line of those keyword search terms. That it was making a difference but when he had them more exact in the backend.
[00:24:29] CS: If you put garlic and press next to each other…
[00:24:31] SV: Yeah, then it would give a little bit more weight than if you had garlic and had four other words and then you had press at the end of that. I think he was saying something like, the most keywords that he found that he could do that with was two in between, so it would be garlic and then maybe bag, stainless and then press right? Then you'd still come up for garlic press, not saying you won't come up it's just he found that it for his anyway that it did make a difference. It’s something to experiment with. When that's being said that makes us doing this work say, “Oh my gosh, I got to sit here and think about how to position all of these, so they make sense and they sound what are the best ones?”
Me personally, don't worry about that right up front, just get related, relevant keywords in there. This way here you have a greater chance of being pulled up for different terms.
[00:25:25] CS: Well and filling that out is critical and I tossed out the strategy that I've started using for that at least upfront and I actually am going back and cleaning that up a little bit when I remove those filler words just because it helps me organize my thoughts so I may be doing what you just described without thinking about it.
But my strategy is I'm going in and scraping the three people who if I could take out and if I can take their spot I would make my product. The same thing that I would be doing when I run the initial PPC campaign where I'm running against the competitors. I'm going in and I’m grabbing those two or three ASINs, I'm running them through a keyword inspector and I’m taking all three of those lists and then running them through a de-duplication tool, the one at SEO Book and I'm finding that actually, for most products it takes three or four full lists of keywords to reach that character that-
[00:26:19] SV: It does, it does, it’s a lot.
[00:26:22] CS: You don't realize how huge that limit is until you actually try to fill it out compared to what was it like 500 or something before and it's now it's 5000. When you're removing duplicates you're not going to have garlic in there 100 times, garlic’s only going to show up once, will have a different ways to talk about a garlic press? Turns out there's a whole bunch and so that's kind of the initial strategy is just dump it and try to fill the 5000 characters with those competitor keywords and then come back and clean it up and so that would be the very next thing that I would do if I was him.
First, consolidate the listings, second set up PPC or refine your PPC through the customer search terms report, third kind of do a relaunch promo to try to get yourself review competitive and Scott on that you know correctly if you feel differently I would say he needs to get probably at least another 75 to 100 if not more reviews to be really competitive with some of the people on the first page. Some of those guys are 127 which if he got 50 or 100 more he definitely be competitive with a lot of those are 250, 300. If he gets that 100 than he should at least be somewhat close to them because he'd be at 180 give or take a which would put him more in line with that.
Then after you set up that promo make sure you filled out all 5000 characters of the expanded search terms in your backend and that should move you at least a little bit. Scott, I’ve run some numbers recently and it looks like filling those out on listings that didn't have those filled out has increased sales about 8 to 10% on average.
[00:28:07] SV: It’s the same, yeah.
[00:28:09] CS: I can’t attribute that to anything else because I haven't changed anything else on those listings and it's across multiple products, across multiple categories. You just end up ranking for more stuff and you'd be shocked at some of the things that people type in to get to your product even if they make no sense to you. It's something somebody’s searching for and if I can get one sale from that a month, I'm going put it back there and see if I can rank for it.
[00:28:31] SV: Yeah. If you think it's complicated and you can’t do it just put something in there that's related. That could be just be again if you want to use the keyword inspector tool and you just want to use merchant words or use Google planner, just take your competitor's URL put it into keyword planner and have it spit out related keywords and then just go off of that. It's better than nothing and you’ve got a better chance of ranking so why not use that space. I would not abandon this product because that was the other question he was like, “What do I do? Do I just give up on this thing?” No, I would not give up on it, I would still get behind it and try to push it but I would also be looking for other products around this market that I could roll out.
I would definitely be looking at that, I’ve talked about this recently kind of like building out your pipeline of products, you should always have those anyway. The other thought that comes to mind real quick and this is just a random thought because I can guarantee almost guaranteed that competitors in this space, in any market out there aren't really doing this but if you had a little bit of… I don’t want to say, aggressive but you went out there, you steadily did it, even if you didn’t want to do it yourself. If you could contact bloggers out there, legitimate bloggers okay, that were in your space and then try to connect with them and give them like one to test and to try like legitimately and then from there if they love it there going to write about it and they're going to put it on their blog and now you got there audience that’s going to see your particular widget.
I think that's a strategy. It‘s a slower strategy but if you can get on someone's blog that gets pretty good traffic you are going to start getting people to click over to your listing on Amazon organically. Again that's something that you can't really plan that as far as like, “Okay this is how many sales I’m going to get from doing this,” but it's a long term almost like building back links to an authority website, it's a slow steady thing, but if you do that over time, you can have a nice steady stream of traffic coming to your listing off of Amazon and then that’s going to obviously take you and put you up above your competitors. Chris what your thoughts on that?
[00:30:45] CS: I love that strategy, the only thing that I'd probably say I probably wouldn't do that for my Amazon products because I can't track it so I've no idea what the ROI of that is, I have no idea if one, I’m helping that blogger, obviously they're going to use an Amazon affiliate link and drive some traffic but in that type of relationship, I would want to know just as a business owner, I would want to know if one that's making me money and two if that's making them money because if it is and I have other products then I can easily go to them and say, “ Hey write about this one, hey write about this one.” They're going to want to do it because it benefits their audience and it benefits them financially, I mean it sounds bad but it helps them out and it's going to help their audience and they know that.
That's probably something I personally would save to drive traffic to my own site because then I get both values out there. I get the values-
[00:31:36] SV: Basically Shopify type site you can drive them to something like that an e-commerce story to get your own authority blogger that has your own product on it with an e-commerce store.
[00:31:45] CS: Absolutely it’s a fantastic strategy and it works really, really, really, really well. The only downside to that is if you're driving traffic to the Amazon listing you have no idea how those people convert. Do they convert better? Do they convert worse? All of those kinds of things. Then the other thing is if they don't convert for you and they're dragging your conversion rate down that may impact your overall search rank on Amazon and that’s just something I haven't personally done enough testing on to see if conversion rate plays a role in and how well you rank on Amazon.
Theoretically, it would because they want to show the person who’s got the highest likelihood of selling whenever somebody searches for something. I would be careful with that it's a great strategy and it can drive a ton of traffic. If you have a market that you know like his market, there's a ton of people who would like his product is worth at least testing and if it correlates to a rise in sales then you keep doing it.
[00:32:40] SV: The other thing I guess you could do, I mean again brainstorming outside here that's what I love doing these is because the kind of think like what else could you do. We’ve already talked about what we would do inside of Amazon but the other thing you can do to is if you did want to give them to a popular blogger or someone in your space or a Facebook fan page, someone that’s in your market that's blogging or talking about this is you could even then offer to give their audience a discount and then you can collect emails from those people after you drive them to a page.
Now you can decide, “Okay, I'm going to drive them,” because you got them I can drive into my own site or I can drive them to Amazon if you wanted to do a promotion in a sense in the future, so would be a long-term thing were you going to keep driving traffic there but you're in control of that traffic.
[00:33:26] CS: That’s not a bad strategy either and that's also a way to make it somewhat trackable, right? You're at least going to know how many people redeemed that promo code. That would give you an idea of your total ROI. It still bugs me and it's because just because of the way the Amazon set up they're never going to give you those traffic numbers, and they're never going to give you that full conversion rate you know we do have access to the conversion rate of the overall listing but I can't say if they come from this, they convert at this rate because the only way that I can track that is with that promo code but if you do it that way you're getting an email and you get to track that a little bit, that's not a bad idea.
[00:34:06] SV: Exactly, exactly. No I love it, I think we've given some good advice here as far as what we would do in this situation. I don't think it's a product that I would abandon. Again especially if he's on page two already for one of those listings, I would do exactly what we said that would be the strategy moving forward. I have to say the product looks great, the pictures look great, the listing looks great so you got a good piece of real estate there that I think that you could get a little bit of a higher price like people are charging $21, $23. You can get that, I really do on with a little bit of effort.
The last thing I would say to is to make sure, if you don't and we didn’t know this because we don’t have you on here live but make sure that you have some type of follow-up sequence in place too because even if you're only getting eight sales a day, 10 sales a day, those are people that can go through that sequence to help you continually grow your reviews over time. You may want to switch up and get a little bit more aggressive with the reviews instead of doing the feedback to review thing, maybe go after the reviews right now just to kind of keep bumping that up quicker than going feedback to review.
That's the other thing I would say is make sure you have something in place whether it's a sales backer, whatever you have or that you're using, hopefully you're using something because even if you're running a promotion, you want that to allow them to be followed up with and then that way you can increase your reviews on that as well. Chris is there anything you want to end with here before we wrap up this hot seat?
[00:35:42] CS: I think the last thing I just want to stress is man, if you really are doing the sales numbers that it looks like you're doing, if you are doing eight sales a day, if you’re not running a promo while we’re looking at this, eight sales a day is not a failure.
Yeah, you have two different variations to get there but it's still eight sales a day, that's pretty good. If you do a couple other things that we that we talked about you can probably double that if not more. It is going to take some pushing, it is going to take some effort and the key ingredient in this and something that we often miss because we hear stories like [Bill's and Rich Kibell] who just destroy it right out of the gate, is that the key ingredient for 90% of this is time.
[00:36:24] SV: Yeah, time.
[00:36:24] CS: Right? Three months, six months and Scott, I know I've said this on the podcast before, Amazon is not like a straight up, straight down kind of thing. It spikes and plateaus. You'll be at eight for three months and then you'll jump to 16 with no rhyme or reason other than you hit the next spot up on the page or whatever and it’s like a day to day switch and then you’ll be at 16 for two months and then you'll be at 20. It doesn't go 16, then the next week 17, the next week 18. Most of the time it goes 1, 5, 30.
[00:37:09] SV: You have to figure that over time. You have to figure that stuff out on at least on 7 day or a 30 day rolling average. You can't base it off a day so yeah. Totally agree with that and even when you’re doing a test of any kind, like if you go and change all those keywords don’t expect that tomorrow you’re going to start ranking. It’s going to take time for it to get into the system, it’s going to take time for them to index, it’s going to take time and it's okay. You do want to see what it is before you and then give it … Maybe then look at how many not just the day but how many visits did you have that you're basing this off of so you can do it like, “Okay we had 1000 from this point to this point, now let's go and wait till we get to another 1,000 after we've made that change and let's see what the numbers look like there. Did it increase or did it decrease it?” That's kind of how you're going to go in and do the split test.
This was great, this was really, really good. I think we nailed to as far as on time we want these to be about 30 minutes because that's about the time… That is the time that they’re going to be at this live event.
If you guys are coming to the live event, there's got to be 30 of you and your listening can't wait, this is going to be awesome and we’re really excited to get to hang out with you guys. If you're not coming because you weren’t able to grab a ticket, we are going to be doing more of these in the future we just don't know when but if you did want to be notified when we do them, head over to theamazingseller.com/live and you'll get updated when we do decide to another one in another area. We’re going to try to make this event in different area or allow it to be in different areas and will be keeping everyone up to date on that as well. Chris, I think this is going to wrap it up, any last little bits of advice you want to give me and let's give you 30 seconds.
[00:39:05] CS: Consistency, consistency, consistency. I think the ingredient of time is the thing that we really need to pay attention to here. Do the things that we outlined, make sure you are checking that customer search term report, you guys aren’t running PPC I'd love to know why because I have yet to find a product where we can at least break even on it and it at the very least even if you’re lose a little bit of money, it gives you the data that you need to move the listing forward. Take what we talked about today apply to your listing if you're in the situation and then let us know what happens.
[00:39:38] SV: Now that's great and you did it man, you did it in 30 seconds. What a guy, you did awesome
[00:39:44] CS: There’s a first time for everything.
[00:39:45] SV: There is. All right so that is going to wrap this up. I want to remind you guys to if you wanted to hang out with Chris and I, we do a live workshop. You can register for that we walk you through for free, we walk you through the five phases for launching a product, from picking the product, sourcing the product, doing a pre-launch, a launch and doing a promotion. We run through all that, we answer live Q&A just like this in a way and you can register for free by heading over to theamazing seller.com/workshop. Once again that's theamazing seller.com/workshop.
Chris this has been awesome, let's wrap it up like we usually do on the podcast. I want everyone to remember that I'm here for you, I believe in you and I’m rooting for you but you have to, you have to … Come on, say it with me, say it loud, Chris you say it too on the count of three, one, two, three, “Take action.” Have an awesome, amazing day guys and I’ll see you right back here on the next episode.
Test, test, test, test, give me a test Chris.
[00:40:54] CS: Test, test, test, test, test,
[00:40:56] SV: Perfect, the levels are perfect, perfect, are we ready?
[00:41:01] CS: We are there's a first time for everything, so let’s do it when we got good levels.
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